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#45221 - 02/28/10 02:41 PM Re: some of the reader votes. [Re: Hunterguy]
Jake Jake addict Registered: 02/27/01 Posts: 592 Loc: Northeastern US	I agree with Hunterguy that the answer to vote inflation is not to add ranks higher than 10. if you vote, vote what you think is appropriate and take the overall vote in the enviroment in which it was recordered. As a writer, comments mean much more to be than numbers. The only reason the number matters to me is because I think it means the story will find more readers. At least you weren't you in the old days, Girlie, when you could endlessly vote on stories. It was pretty routine for authors to vote their stories up and vote other people down. _________________________ Website: Jake's Wonderland Twitter: JakeMarlowWrtr
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#45226 - 02/28/10 11:34 PM Re: some of the reader votes. [Re: Jake]
Sextified Sextified enthusiast Registered: 08/18/08 Posts: 367	Jake and Hunterguy, Do you guys think that the number of votes to reads is down these days as well? I think that part of what's skewing the votes is that . . . for the most part . . . people have stopped voting negatively. They just don't bother any more. So the ratio is off because the people who really like our stuff still feel like voting. I know I have gotten into the 'bad' habit of voting only as a measure of support. Unless an author specifically requests constructive feedback, I don't vote unless its either a 9 or a 10. Sometimes I'll send an 8 someone's way with a note. If the story really needs help, and its asked for, I'll send a private comment instead of voting 7 or lower. So I HAVE noticed my reads to vote ratio falling. I mean 3810 actual click thru reads and it only yields 14 votes? When I am practically begging for honest votes and constructive private feedback? I like that ES is smaller than Literotica . . . much fewer trolls . . . but its getting a bit lonely out here on a limb sometimes! Sextified
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#45229 - 03/01/10 10:18 AM Re: some of the reader votes. [Re: Sextified]
Jake Jake addict Registered: 02/27/01 Posts: 592 Loc: Northeastern US	It does seem like fewer people vote. And like you, I only typically vote if I really like something too, or if I read an author who I think has promise as a writer, but has some issues, in my opinion. Think about it, if potentially 3810 people read your story and only 14 people voted, what do the votes really mean? I think we forget that most people are reading something to get off and if it does that they are happy with it. The people on here discussing writing, and the people who take time to send you comments are the exception to the rule. We don't like to admit that, because many of us put a lot of time and effort into crafting our work, but I'd say that probably 80% who pass through this site are looking to get off and probably forget the story as soon as they cum. _________________________ Website: Jake's Wonderland Twitter: JakeMarlowWrtr
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#45231 - 03/01/10 09:38 PM Re: some of the reader votes. [Re: Jake]
Sextified Sextified enthusiast Registered: 08/18/08 Posts: 367	Jake, I think you're right . . . and I do forget that sometimes. I'm trying to learn my craft, and I take these things very seriously. I'm doing this because I like the process, think I could truly be good at it someday, and have something to share. I could be already writing the old fashioned 'sword and sorcery' trilogy of novels I want to create. Or be exploring some other genre to get prepared. I want to stay away from where I will really be writing. I don't want to use up or dilute the ideas I am formulating. But whatever I write, people will be at the center of it. The comments I do get . . . added to my pre-readers . . . mixed together with the forum goers are really helping me. So is exploring my own feelings about sex and relationships. I guess I can get greedy like anyone else. If I had ten good comments per chapter I would want twenty. If I had twenty I would want forty. If there was an eleven, I would want a bucket full of those. It's just hard to be satisfied with just the work itself, especially when you are far too close to it. I can't imagine how 'real' authors do it. Working on a project in the dark for a year or more? I wonder what kind of 'support' group they have? The one thing I miss is that I have stopped reading other work almost entirely. Mainstream, Mysteries, Science Fiction, Fantasy and even most Erotica. Just hard to enjoy it as much as I used to . . . at least until I finish this thing . . . I'm buying loads of classic original editions getting ready for my break! Sextified
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#45235 - 03/02/10 09:17 AM Re: some of the reader votes. [Re: Sextified]
Jake Jake addict Registered: 02/27/01 Posts: 592 Loc: Northeastern US	I also write ebooks through an online publisher. Those works are anywhere from 50k to 65k words and the last one took me about six months to write because I write somewhat inconsistently. i had no input from anyone while I was writing it. I wrote because I liked the story I was telling and at the end of the day that's what you need. You need to enjoy what you're doing. Even when I wrote longer pieces for here, I finished them first and then posted them piecemeal. I prefer not to have input during the writing process because I don't want to be influenced, unless I ask for it. It's my story, it's my vision and hopefully people will like it. And I always know that some people won't. Here my feedback and "payment" is user comments. With my ebooks, my "payment" is actual payment, which is pretty satisfying. $\:\)$ _________________________ Website: Jake's Wonderland Twitter: JakeMarlowWrtr
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#45242 - 03/02/10 09:17 PM Re: some of the reader votes. [Re: Jake]
Sextified Sextified enthusiast Registered: 08/18/08 Posts: 367	Originally Posted By: Jake I wrote because I liked the story I was telling and at the end of the day that's what you need. You need to enjoy what you're doing. - - - I prefer not to have input during the writing process because I don't want to be influenced, unless I ask for it. It's my story, it's my vision and hopefully people will like it. And I always know that some people won't. Here my feedback and "payment" is user comments. With my ebooks, my "payment" is actual payment, which is pretty satisfying. $\:\)$ I used to write all of the time when I was younger. I did it mainly for myself, a few friends and my English teachers. I stopped writing for a very long stretch. Some things happened in my life that caused me to stop actually putting things down on paper. You know how counselors and therapists are always after their patients to start a journal? There is a reason for that. Its almost impossible to honestly write about your situation and not have it be changed. I felt I was stuck in a situation I had to endure - change wasn't really an option - and writing anything down became very painful for me. But I still did so in my head and in my dreams. I read because I loved the stories and then read them over an over to analyze their structure and layering. Now I am slowly learning to use everything I have seen while developing my own style. I pulled off of Literotica and was pretty much determined to write all three books on my own. Then I decided to give ES a try. Its been a good fit. The basic story has remained unchanged, but the layering I have been after has developed much faster than I thought it would. That accelerated pace has largely been due to having a few loyal readers feedback. I'd call it enhancing the story - rather than having it altered. But I totally understand what you mean. At first I had lots of responses 'suggesting' things. I spent quite a bit of effort 'fending' off that kind of input. I would finish this thing even if I couldn't post it at all, but its nice that I can. I too hope that when its all over I can add the real impact of getting paid for e-publishing this thing. Even if its not much, it should allow me the resources and confidence to proceed with the main projects. I have learned some things about a few of my favorite authors. They all had a few trusted people that they could let see their stuff in the development stages. Their friends kept them on track and smoothed out the bumps and pain sometimes associated with the creative process. I guess thats what I really meant by 'allowing' reader's comments to affect me. One of my authors is very streaky and ethereal. They write in huge draining bursts and then rest and ponder. They are emotional and that creativity and edge shows up in their work. The other has a suit and tie, office, schedules and vacations. Its a job, one which he loves, but its very compartmentalised. The work has a very intricate layered depth to it. Another of my original influences committed suicide. One was an alcoholic that drank himself to death. One has another completely separate career and is a devoted family man. Another is an award winning artist, but has strung out their huge series of books to the point of losing fans. One wrote two books of a classic trilogy, yet cannot bring themselves to ever finish the last book, even after twenty years. Authors are people. They are all different. The works are so varied and the older stuff still stands out today. I'm trying to learn who to integrate the process into my life smoothly, and end up with something that could become a second career eventually. I help artists, writers, and businesses bring their stuff to life on paper. Once the project is finished . . . my pay day ends . . . and if their stuff is good it keeps on going. I know two guys who are VERY well off right now and have totally changed the lives of everyone around them. The took a quirky talent for mockery and escaped the 9 to 5 rat race where they made money for someone else. I would be happy with a single old historic house in a small town in the middle of no where . . . a nice room with a view to write in . . . and places for my cat's to enjoy. And the satisfaction of creating something that people enjoy and that might last. Sextified
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#45876 - 05/23/10 04:41 PM Re: some of the reader votes. [Re: Sextified]
Bitemeplease Bitemeplease journeyman Registered: 05/23/10 Posts: 72 Loc: UK	I think I possibly had the weirdest vote. I got a message telling me just how much they loved my story and how they wanted me to keep writing and all that - sounded veryu good until I saw the bit at the bottom that stated This comment was accompanied with a vote of 2 for this story. 2!!!! For a story they loved??? I don't get it! Has anyone else experienced this? _________________________ You know you want to bite it - so bite it already!
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#45877 - 05/23/10 05:11 PM Re: some of the reader votes. [Re: Bitemeplease]
AntEater AntEater Pooh-Bah Registered: 02/06/08 Posts: 1899 Loc: UK	Some people don't read how the scoring system works. I get evaluated like this every week by customers for work, I once had a eval where the customer comments were glowing but the score was at the fire on the spot level. When the boss rang the customer to ask what the problem had been they were again glowing in their praise... "but you marked him as being unacceptable" Oh did I? I thought I'd given a high mark. I've also read product evals on the web where customers have given the bottom score and then said how good the product is and explained that they gave it a low mark so that people would read the review... Nowt so strange as folk. _________________________ Anteater, or thanks to CG "Monsieur Manger de Tante" $\:D$
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#45878 - 05/23/10 06:18 PM Re: some of the reader votes. [Re: AntEater]
Girlie1980 Girlie1980 veteran Registered: 09/23/09 Posts: 1321	Bitemeplease, Maybe the person thought 1 was the best and 10 was the worst? I've given all of your stories a 10. And recommended them to friends. But the other day I gave an 8 vote, and got a nasty message from the author. She said I pulled down her score. She also said that it was the lowest vote I ever gave. Which isn't true, but I can see why it would look that way. I started a new account when I posted my one story, and when that got in the archive, I used that account to go back and read all the top scoring stories. Of course they got to be top stories for a reason. I felt like I had really good reason to not give that story a 9 or 10. I thought long and hard before voting. I wanted to make sure that I wasn't giving a less-high vote because it had things in it that weren't my sort of thing (it WAS my sort of thing) or because I was just having the kind of day when I wasn't in the mood. If it were either of those 2 reasons, I would just not vote (and I do that often). I would have told her my reason, but she didn't seem to want to hear it. I figured she would probably just rather be upset at me. I'm ok with that. I didn't think 8 was that low. She had to have other votes of 8. How much could it have pulled her average down? I got a vote of 5 on my story, and it didn't pull it down that much.
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#45881 - 05/24/10 02:12 AM Re: some of the reader votes. [Re: Girlie1980]
Bitemeplease Bitemeplease journeyman Registered: 05/23/10 Posts: 72 Loc: UK	Originally Posted By: Girlie1980 Bitemeplease, Maybe the person thought 1 was the best and 10 was the worst? I've given all of your stories a 10. And recommended them to friends. But the other day I gave an 8 vote, and got a nasty message from the author. She said I pulled down her score. She also said that it was the lowest vote I ever gave. Which isn't true, but I can see why it would look that way. I started a new account when I posted my one story, and when that got in the archive, I used that account to go back and read all the top scoring stories. Of course they got to be top stories for a reason. I felt like I had really good reason to not give that story a 9 or 10. I thought long and hard before voting. I wanted to make sure that I wasn't giving a less-high vote because it had things in it that weren't my sort of thing (it WAS my sort of thing) or because I was just having the kind of day when I wasn't in the mood. If it were either of those 2 reasons, I would just not vote (and I do that often). I would have told her my reason, but she didn't seem to want to hear it. I figured she would probably just rather be upset at me. I'm ok with that. I didn't think 8 was that low. She had to have other votes of 8. How much could it have pulled her average down? I got a vote of 5 on my story, and it didn't pull it down that much. Thanks so much for that, maybe that was the case - I did reply and ask. I admit to wanting a really good average score as I was 10th the last time I checked on the top authors list - but to have a go at someone for giving me a score of 8?? Me thinks that author is taking themselves far too seriously and obviously not respecting other people's opinions. I'm pretty certain they might have scored other people low in order to make them feel better. I wouldn't mind scores of 8 - ok they're not 9's or even 10's but it's still a good score. Bitemeplease xx _________________________ You know you want to bite it - so bite it already!
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